Topic: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Hi, i use SVP to watch movies on a Sony Bravia TV (connected via hdmi). This TV has Motionflow options (motionflow xr 800) and CineMotion. I turn on or off Motionflow? there is no conflict with svp?

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Turn of Motionflow in tv and let SVP handle it.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I do not see much difference with svp activated. (In a movie with 23.976fps processed at 60fps with svp) for example, that film could tell the difference?

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I use both. SVP + Philips PMR400 (I have Philips TV). No conflicts. smile
Difference can be at complicated places. Difficult for interpolation. Difference will be in smoothness and in artifacts amount.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I do not see the difference (notebook or TV) I will go changing other settings of svp/frc menu.
Exactly who are the "artifacts "?

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Artifacts are the errors of motion interpolation.
For example. See pictures here: http://www.compression.ru/video/frame_r … _frcn.html

7 (edited by Nintendo Maniac 64 06-05-2016 20:06:06)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Personally I would think that you would get better results by setting your PC to output at 23.976Hz or 24Hz and letting motionflow/CineMotion do everything...

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

If one did as Nintendo Maniac 64 said then it will alternative way to get smoothing by TV only. And it is very important to set output refreshrate as video framerate. Otherwise we can get stutter on the TV.

9 (edited by Blackfyre 07-05-2016 21:28:01)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I have the 43" Sony W800C being used as a TV connected to the PC for watching movies/series. And I owned the Sony 32" W800C before that (which actually had a better panel/screen, but I wanted a bigger screen). And I've done a lot of testing on both.

Under Advanced Settings;

Motion Settings --> Turn OFF (aka Disable) Motionflow and Film Mode. These are the settings you asked about, turn them both OFF if you're using SVP 4 Pro. Because they do a worse job at motion interpolation in comparison to SVP (unless you own the really expensive high-end TV's), and when they're combined together, they just add extra artifacts if you're already using SVP.

Clarity Settings --> Make sure Sharpness is set to 50, Reality Creation set to AUTO, Random Noise Reduction = OFF & Digital Noise Reduction = OFF

Colour Settings --> You need to tell me which Sony Bravia TV you have, aka the model number, so I might find the best settings to calibrate your TV. Unless you've already used a calibration device.

Brightness Settings --> Brightness = MAX, Contrast = Max, Gamma = 0, Black Level = 50, and BLACK ADJUST = OFF (MUST do this), and Adv. Contrast Enhancer = OFF (Must do this too).

For SVP Settings use the following: (Let me know what you think after watching a few movies/series with these settings). These settings should decrease artifacts to the minimum, and maintain the smooth feeling of motion interpolation.

http://i.imgur.com/7KViWLC.png

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Hi Blackfire,  I have the Sony KDL-50W805C.

The TV had set in much the same way. Now configured like you. (Except BLACK ADJUST, I like ON and not let me disable CineMotion, not know why). As you have the color values?

In the SVP settings, Frame interpolation mode, set it up as 1.5m, because sometimes in Uniform does not look good. (Many artiffack around the figures, like as bubbles in the outline of the figures, not what I mean).

The movies/series see them very well. I not see much difference because the values they had were very similar.

Nvidia GTX 970M
Which graphics card you have? nvidia? that you use to nvidia settings (resolution / video / screen, etc.)?

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

It's important to note that, if you're OCD about artifacts, that you should really make sure that your screen refresh rate is an exact multiple of the source video frame rate.

12 (edited by oguignant 08-05-2016 03:19:26)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

NM64,

the TV is set to 60hz and all movies are in 23.976fps. The svp I set "Fixed frame rate 60 fps". It's OK?

13 (edited by Nintendo Maniac 64 08-05-2016 03:54:44)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

oguignant wrote:

the TV is set to 60hz and all movies are in 23.976fps. The svp I set "Fixed frame rate 60 fps". It's OK?

Well different settings have differing amounts of artifacts and different people have different sensitive to said artifacts, so your mileage may vary.

Nevertheless, setting your refresh rate to an exact multiple of the source video frame rate will also give a smoother result.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Thks NM64. I now change "Fixed frame rate" by "to screen" and looks perfect. Almost no are artifacts.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I must ask though, without the use of custom resolutions, does your TV only let you select 60Hz as the output refresh rate in MPC-HC?

16 (edited by oguignant 08-05-2016 06:37:44)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I define it from the video card of the notebook (alienware 17 r3 / nvidia gtx 970m). The maximum allowed is 60hz. I can customize it, but I think for hdmi the maximum is 1080/60p. You can see print screen of settings...

these are the specs of tv ...

Corresponding PC input signal
(Resolution, Horizontal frequency/Vertical frequency)
640 x 480, 31.5 kHz/60 Hz
800 x 600, 37.9 kHz/60 Hz
1024 x 768, 48.4 kHz/60 Hz
1152 x 864, 67.5 kHz/75 Hz (2K Full HD models or 4K models only)
1280 x 1024, 64.0 kHz/60 Hz (2K Full HD models or 4K models only)
1600 x 900, 56.0 kHz/60 Hz (2K Full HD models or 4K models only)
1680 x 1050, 65.3 kHz/60 Hz (2K Full HD models or 4K models only)
1920 x 1080, 67.5 kHz/60 Hz (2K Full HD models or 4K models only)*

* The 1080p timing, when applied to the HDMI input, will be treated as a video timing and not a PC timing. This will affect the [Display] settings. To view PC content, set [Wide mode] to [Full], and [Display area] to [Full pixel] (2K models) or [+1] (4K models). ([Display area] is configurable only when [Auto display area] is set to [Off].)

Note
This TV does not support interlaced PC signals.
For optimum picture quality, it is recommended that you use the signals from the above list “Corresponding PC input signal” on your PC settings.
Depending on the connection status, the image may be blurred or smeared. In this case, change the PC’s settings, then select another input signal from the above list “Corresponding PC input signal.”
1920 x 1080/60 Hz output may not be available, depending on your PC. Even if 1920 x 1080/60 Hz output is selected, the actual output signal may differ. In this case, change the PC’s settings, then select another input signal from the above list “Corresponding PC input signal.”

http://i.imgur.com/LyGQdnO.jpg

Post's attachments

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17 (edited by Nintendo Maniac 64 08-05-2016 07:37:10)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

oguignant wrote:

I can customize it, but I think for hdmi the maximum is 1080/60p. You can see print screen of settings...]

This is not actually true - even on my measly AMD E-350 APU I can make a custom resolution of 1920x1080 64Hz and my TV will accept it over HDMI just fine (and will even show "64Hz" on the actual TV's OSD).  (for reference, my TV is a Toshiba 39L1350U and, by default, only accepts 60Hz at 1080p).

However, in my case, 64Hz is the maximum I can go for 1080p, so for 24fps and 25fps video I need to use 48Hz and 50Hz respectively rather than 72Hz and 75Hz.


Anyway, remember that HDMI and DVI use the exact same video signal and therefore are electrically the same, and DVI certainly isn't limited to 60Hz at 1920x1080.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I highly recommend you don't overclock or change the refresh rate of your Sony TV, their panels are not designed with overclocking in mind.

When you're watching videos with SVP, set the target to "screen" which is 59.940. You've already done that (which is good).

With the settings I use above by the way I rarely ever notice artifacts, also you're using artifact masking "strongest" which just ruins the smoothness of the video. Change it to "Strong", it helps a lot.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Thks Blackfire, i will change artifact masking to strong. I'll keep playing with the settings svp.

so far, the best way is that you gave me. but with "Frame interpolation mode" at 1.5 or 1.

20 (edited by Nintendo Maniac 64 08-05-2016 08:39:03)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

It must be noted though that 48Hz and 50Hz would not be overclocking but rather would underclocking which is very risk-free.

Even though 48Hz is less than 60Hz, a 24fps video interpolated to 48Hz should still look smoother than at 60Hz, and a 25fps video interpolated to 50Hz will definitely look smoother than if it was interpolated to 60Hz.

Consider that all modern TV panels and scalars must be able to handle 50Hz video signals as that is the standard in PAL territories like Europe.


DISCLAIMER: The idea of setting your screen refresh rate to be an exact multiple of the source video frame rate is not required in any way, shape, or form.  However, we must also not give a false impression of danger when it comes to the likes of custom resolutions - an easy example is that many 1080p TVs with VGA inputs do not make 1080p available in their EDID over anything but HDMI (possibly for DRM reasons), yet making a custom resolution will let you run 1080p over VGA perfectly fine (my own Toshiba 39L1350U is one of such TVs).

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Yes this Sony tv support 30, 48, 50 and 60 Hz.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

I understood perfectly. I will continue playing  with the svp and tv settings/configurations. I'll try to 48Hz and then tell them.

ThKS!

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

NM64, you are right, using 50hz looks much better. Almost no artifacts.

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Nintendo Maniac 64 wrote:

It's important to note that, if you're OCD about artifacts, that you should really make sure that your screen refresh rate is an exact multiple of the source video frame rate.

First of all I've wanted to say this for a while but artifacts are always there, in fact decreasing the FPS from 60 to 48 would for example decrease artifacts from 60 to 57 (just an example, not exact numbers), but it decreases smoothness from 60 to 48 (which is massive). So the trade off is definitely not worth it. Stick to running the highest refresh rate you possibly can, in your case on the TV, it's 60Hz or 59.940Hz to be exact.

Anyway, if you use Madvr + MPC, use Madvr or MPC to change refreshrate, because those refreshrates below 60 are all built into the Sony TV.

PS - My hardware:

CPU: Intel Core i7 4790K @ 4.7Ghz
Motherboard: Gigabyte Z97X-Gaming GT
Videocard: Gigabyte 280X OC WindForce
RAM: 16Gb EvoPotenza @ 2400Mhz (CL11)

Re: Help! Svp - Sony bravia - motionflow

Blackfire, 

The TV and video card I'll leave it at 60hz and svp settings I use in your configuration, but with Frame interpolation mode Set to 1.5m. If I leave in uniform, average or 1m, it looks bad, with many artifacts. I do not know how I lose using 1.5M.