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Blackfyre wrote:Hi all, I've been gone for a while. There is a couple of SVP updates, and new MPV update with new changes, a couple of Windows Updates that added Dolby Vision too in the HDR section, etc
RTX 3090, 4K, 24 to 48FPS @ custom 48Hz
Still using RIFE 4.16 Lite (v2) for Frame Height > 1700
And using RIFE 4.25 (v2) for Frame Height < 1699
I am just wondering if anything stands out or outdated in my MPV config that I should look to upgrade/change? Fix?
Scrollable below:
ontop
fullscreen=yes
d3d11-exclusive-fs=yes
volume=100
volume-max=100
vo=gpu-next
gpu-api=d3d11
hwdec=auto-copy
hwdec-codecs=all
gpu-context=d3d11
fbo-format=rgba16hf
hdr-compute-peak=no
target-colorspace-hint=yes
tone-mapping=st2094-40
scale=ewa_lanczos
cscale=ewa_lanczos
dscale=ewa_lanczos
tscale=ewa_lanczos
osd-level=1
osd-bar-w=25
osd-color=0.6/0.6
osd-font-size=30
osd-font='Inter Tight Medium'
#sub-gray
sub-auto=fuzzy
#sub-gauss=0.9
slang=eng,en,und
sub-fix-timing=yes
sub-filter-sdh=yes
subs-with-matching-audio=no
demuxer-mkv-subtitle-preroll=yes
sub-font-size=42
sub-border-size=1
sub-font="Verdana Bold"
sub-color=0.6/0.6/0.6/0.6
sub-pos=100
sub-margin-y=3
sub-margin-x=100
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\FSRCNNX_x2_8-0-4-1.glsl"
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\KrigBilateral.glsl"
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\SSimDownscaler.glsl"
There's a few commands that do nothing at all which means they don't currently do any harm and I'm not going to repeat myself 
The rest is just personal choice. The shaders are fine, but these days I only use them for edge cases, because when watching in VR on a very large screen at short distance exposes issues with external shaders that you won't see on a TV or even on a projector. Aliasing is the most obvious but depending on the source, other issues can and usually do arise.
The heavy models should have been the best, but they turned out to be worse than the "lite" models. v26 was supposed to be better than v25 but it isn't. He did try but guess he got as far as he could.
scb wrote:Is RIFE v4.26v2 pretty much peak RIFE capability?
I know the author moved on to other things but do we have the best thing now anyway?
Perhaps we just need GPU power to catch up
4.25.
Not the best. But it's the best we have.
GPU power won't solve artifacts. Better models will.
themrcul wrote:Thank you Chainik, I'll investigate that asap.
I got Assumefps working. If you read the manual you will find the correct syntax and missing commands that need to be changed. All it does is speed up the playback so I'm not sure what help that is for you. I tested ConvertFPS with a partial encode of Gemini Man and it looks like that works with the requisite additional changes so I'm trying it out on a full encode
I did a bit more reading and this is what I found:
ConvertFPS doesn't drop or insert frames. It instead either blends multiple frames into one (to decrease fps) or "switches" one frame into two by literally breaking it into parts. Blend obviously results in motion blurring, and switch introduces wobble during pans.
I assume this is why the author of BD3D2MK3D doesn't recommend doing it. But if there isn't too much motion blur then maybe Rife can sort out the pan wobbles which is what it does anyway.
Final update: Maybe if I watch the whole movie without fast forwarding or rewinding it will play all the way through. But otherwise it kind of works then the video stops. But that might be to do with my configuration.
I'm going to try AssumeFPS(120) and see what happens with encoding. I might just try AssumeFPS(60) after that.
Wrong syntax! Also Wrong command.
Xenocyde wrote:dawkinscm wrote:Is anyone else experiencing multiple crashes with the last few versions of SVP? It just disappears from my Windows system tray and when I look in Task Manager, the process is no longer there.
Think I updated to latest version a few days ago IIRC. No problems here.
It's been crashing the last couple of versions for me. If no one else is experiencing this then maybe it doesn't like something on my system.
Is anyone else experiencing multiple crashes with the last few versions of SVP? It just disappears from my Windows system tray and when I look in Task Manager, the process is no longer there.
Xenocyde wrote:dawkinscm wrote:Xenocyde wrote:Can Smooth Motion be used with RIFE or SVP somehow? It just got officially enabled for RTX 4000 GPUs in addition to the initial RTX 5000 models.
I have smooth motion on globally but I can't get my media player or anything to recognize it. However this reminded me to turn on smooth motion option in mpv and the even when I'm using remote desktop as well as the TV, the micro-stutters are reduced or gone. I used this setting before, but I probably over-complicated it by using multiple options when I should have just left it at default. So if this remains the case then I don't need RTX smooth motion anyway
Where is the smooth motion option in MPV? Does it need to be added to the config file?
Yes add the command "video-sync=display-resample" to your config.
This command by itself is not software interpolation and different command options can be used to be more like it. But when combined with SVP I had an instant reduction of micro-stutters, frame lagging and an overall improvement in smoothness, even with my GPU threads turned down to 1. YMMV.
Xenocyde wrote:Can Smooth Motion be used with RIFE or SVP somehow? It just got officially enabled for RTX 4000 GPUs in addition to the initial RTX 5000 models.
I have smooth motion on globally but I can't get my media player or anything to recognize it. However this reminded me to turn on smooth motion option in mpv and the even when I'm using remote desktop as well as the TV, the micro-stutters are reduced or gone. I used this setting before, but I probably over-complicated it by using multiple options when I should have just left it at default. So if this remains the case then I don't need RTX smooth motion anyway
Honza wrote:dawkinscm wrote:This was the impression I got when reading about Topaz vs SVP but that last post gave me pause for thought. I've noticed recently that the better the picture quality the better Rife looks. This doesn't quite make sense to me. It may just be a function of a more stable picture. Rife v4.25 is very smooth and does a good enough job at reducing artifacts. I'm still experimenting but I always go back to v4.25.
4.25 v2 is best for movies, I think.
4.25 v2 lite not, heavy is not working, 4.26 v2 heavy is the worst.
It may be good for regular movies, but not sports.
Typical challenge is boxes with timing, score etc and camera rolling when following a movement.
Boxes are bouncing, moving around, getting distorted, it is very unpleasant.
v2 is no longer needed according to the devs as there is no longer any advantage to using it which his true except maybe for GPU usage. I've just tried it for the first time in a while and it reduces my GPU load by at least 10% so unless I see some extra artifacts I'm going to stick with that. 4.25 is the best but also the most GPU intensive. 4.25 heavy and 4.26 heavy struggle to play my 4k content. But I remember them not being great anyway.
Honza wrote:dawkinscm wrote:Did you do the Rife 4.25 vs Topaz comparison?
Yes, I did.
Topaz 7.x with "Chronos fast" model seems to give best performace vs quality for Full HD 25 to 60 FPS conversion.
On my specs, it takes about 2x time of input video, with same output resolution.
Converting to native LCD FPS is primary benefit. Resolution is not so important because HW upscaling is doing good enough job, it makes processing time much slower and final file much larger.
Very user friendly, usually works out of the box, price is a bit higher but final quality is better.
It can do motion deblur, stabilization etc, which is more HW demanding (and out of reach for live playback on current high-end GPUs).
If I want to go for quality, Topaz is the way.
This was the impression I got when reading about Topaz vs SVP but that last post gave me pause for thought. I've noticed recently that the better the picture quality the better Rife looks. This doesn't quite make sense to me. It may just be a function of a more stable picture. Rife v4.25 is very smooth and does a good enough job at reducing artifacts. I'm still experimenting but I always go back to v4.25.
Honza wrote:Hi there,
I will try to transcode using SVP before watching to get a comparation later...
Did you do the Rife 4.25 vs Topaz comparison?
I've had problems with my self encoded FSBS files and separately with 3D glasses connected to a PC and the issue in both cases is that FSBS uses a 32:9 aspect ratio which is different to the standard 16:9 AR. The 3D glasses connected to the PC is similar to your situation and the solution was to use VLC with the correct AR. You may have to do something similar with your laptop.
zomaan wrote:wanted to try RIFE but SVP is not detecting my 5070ti , only integrated AMD GPU.
checked in "MPC-HC/filter/LAV video decoder" and it detects my 5070. is it not supported in SVP?
windows 11
Practically all Nvidia RTX cards are supported in Windows 10 and 11. Read the install instructions for MPC.
jimdogma7 wrote:Hi, me again . I'm back because I never got an answer to my question, "Why I cannot get full-SBS or top-bottom to work with SVP?" A kind member of the forum was kind enough to respond to my question, but it did not answer my question. It would be great if an SVP developer, such as CHAINIK maybe, could respond with a word or two.
I have an Acer 4K spatiallabs laptop that can play "glasses-free" stereoscopic videos in full HD 1080p resolution. They have their own, build-in SpatialLabs media player that can play all formats, half-SBS, full-SBS, top-bottom, etc. So it CAN be done. With SVP, all I can get to work is half-SBS. I'm seeking an explanation for this or, better yet, a fix. Is this an issue with SVP, or is it an issue with the "hosting" media player I am using, which is SMplayer which uses an MPV engine? That is all I am looking for.
Is there a way to configure SVP to play full-SBS and/or Top-Bottom on SMplayer? If not, can I configure it to work on some other media player? Or am I stuck just using SVP to play half-SBS videos? If that's the case that's fine, but I would like to hear it sraight from a developer, such as CHAINIK, instead of someone who is just guessing. Thanks.
I used to play FTAB with SVP with no issues but FSBS is essentially 4K and it's a lot more resource heavy. I play FSBS with MPV all the time so SVP does play FSBS and MPV shouldn't make any difference. So maybe there is a display resolution limit or some other limit imposed by the media player. You also need to explain what you mean by "not working".
r75cq wrote:narkohol wrote:r75cq wrote:I don't know if this will work for you, but it seems like it might be the same issue, although my PotPlayer didnt need SVP to have this issue it has always had this issue.
In my case it is SVP. It happens the moment SVP gets enabled, and it goes back to normal if I close it.
Forcing the SBS mode seems to work, but SVP reporting a '1920x1080' resolution is what was worrying me. I guess it is counting just per eye? because if not there should be a noticeable difference when enabling/disabling it, and I don't see it...
Mine reports 1920x1080 as well, I think it's just per eye as you say.
Yes I've noticed that. If you look in the scaling page, even if it is set to downscale to QHD it still reports FHD 1920x1080 then says "Scaling: none"
Chainik wrote:"3d mode" in SVP cuts the frame into two halves then processes them independently, then merges them back into large frame
splitting and merging large frames are not really fast operations in Avisynth/Vapoursynth...
not a problem with 1920*2160, but a big performance penalty for 4K+ stereo clips
FYI for those with packet drop and stuttering issues, removing black bars might help. After doing this, I am now able to run full resolution 3D+SBS with no stuttering of dropped packets.
28adam28 wrote:Yes, i understand. But if i use only the CPU (which is much weaker than the GPU i think) there is no frame drop. (or very few). And if I connect the Dell monitor to the 4060 instead of the Epson projector and turn back on the GPU acceleration also there is no frame drop.
That is strange and I'm out of ideas.
Are you using the Nvidia Tensor cores? If you are then the 4060 only has 96. The Quadro RTX 5000 has 384. Even with generational improvement there's no way to overcome over 3x more Tensor cores. Even if you are not using Tensor cores, the Quadro also has twice 2x bus width and better overall raw performance. Raw performance is not always the same as gaming performance.
jimdogma7 wrote:dawkinscm wrote:jimdogma7 wrote:I have an Acer SpatialLabs 15 glasses-free 3D stereoscopic laptop with 3840x1080 resolution. I can get videos encoded in HALF-SBS to work just fine. However, no go for full-SBS. What happens is that the video image is "windowed" meaning that it only fills up a portion of the screen, such that there are big black bars on the top and bottom of the image and sometimes on the sides. Plus the image is stretched out horizontally. I usually use the SMplayer media player which uses the MPV engine. However, I also have the same problem in MPC-BE.
I know the laptop can play full-SBS videos because there's a built in "SpatialLabs player" that can play them just fine. The player has other problems, though, such as you can't slow down the playback. Therefore, I prefer to use SMplayer with SVP but can' seem to find why I can't make it work.
SVP has nothing to do with how your player presents a 3D image. That's purely down to your player and settings. However it sounds like what you are seeing is a 3840x1080 resolution image on the screen because that's exactly how it looks when presented properly. A thin strip going horizontally across the center of the screen with the top and bottom of the screen blank like the image below.
Ok, maybe I should have phrased my question differently and asked, "HOW can I get a full SBS video to play on my glasses-free 3D laptop?" Oh, and by the way, I made a mistake-- the resloution of the monitor is a full 4K 3840x2160 resolution, if that makes a difference.
As far as media players, I've tried just about all of them, potplayer, KM player, etc., etc. With the exception of the built-in "SpatialLabs player" the only one I can find that will play a Full SBS video on the laptop is Stereoscopic player, but that player has other problems. For one, I don't think it's supported anymore and isn't undergoing ongoing development. Two, it doesn't support SVP. Three, and most importantly, it doesn't have an option to speed up and slow down video playback. This is why I use SVP, so I can slow down videos and still have smooth playback. I'm not an expert in these matters so if someone knows of a specific player that works with SVP and can play full SBS videos or can just help me with a solution in general, that would be great.
P.S. Again, the built-in SpatialLabs player has an option to play 1) 2D-3D conversion (on the fly), 2) half-SBS, 3) full-SBS, and 4) Over-under. So the monitor can seemingly play ALL formats available within the player. However, the 3D software package also includes another feature called SpatialLabs "GO" where you can play any video on the screen in stereoscopic 3D as long as you can get the video into fullscreen mode (e.g. a YouTube video). From here, you have an option to do one of two things, 1) if the video you're watching is in 2D, you can click a button that will convert it into 3D "on the fly," 2) if you are watching a side-by-side movie, as in the one dawkinscm posted above, there is a button you can click that will merge the side-by-side images into a 3D image. There's not an option that will merge a top-down or over-under video, which seems odd. So I'm not sure if this may be part of the problem or not. Again, I'm not an expert.
OK that makes more sense. For PCs, I've used VLC with the Virtue Pro XR/AR glasses which only supports full-SBS, but 3D is painful to get working properly in VLC because of the aspect ratio. Bino3D apparently supports all 3D formats but I've never used it myself. I remember the code for mpc-be media player being able to handle SBS, but the option did not exist in the menu.
jimdogma7 wrote:I have an Acer SpatialLabs 15 glasses-free 3D stereoscopic laptop with 3840x1080 resolution. I can get videos encoded in HALF-SBS to work just fine. However, no go for full-SBS. What happens is that the video image is "windowed" meaning that it only fills up a portion of the screen, such that there are big black bars on the top and bottom of the image and sometimes on the sides. Plus the image is stretched out horizontally. I usually use the SMplayer media player which uses the MPV engine. However, I also have the same problem in MPC-BE.
I know the laptop can play full-SBS videos because there's a built in "SpatialLabs player" that can play them just fine. The player has other problems, though, such as you can't slow down the playback. Therefore, I prefer to use SMplayer with SVP but can' seem to find why I can't make it work.
SVP has nothing to do with how your player presents a 3D image. That's purely down to your player and settings. However it sounds like what you are seeing is a 3840x1080 resolution image on the screen because that's exactly how it looks when presented properly. A thin strip going horizontally across the center of the screen with the top and bottom of the screen blank like the image below.
Chainik wrote:"3d mode" in SVP cuts the frame into two halves then processes them independently, then merges them back into large frame
splitting and merging large frames are not really fast operations in Avisynth/Vapoursynth...
not a problem with 1920*2160, but a big performance penalty for 4K+ stereo clips
I've modified the code in base.avs and base.py to stop 3D SBS and make it work as 2D. It's still working as 3D SBS. What else do I need to change this?
r75cq wrote:Hey GeoFly,
I'm interested in playing 3D Blurays at 60hz. I'm curious if you can clarify your statement below.
GeoFly wrote:My 4080 super video card can't handle playback of the Unbelievable.S01E01.2160p.HDR.Interpolation Test.mkv video because it isn't powerful enough. I can only handle playing back 4k videos which have a input resolution height of less that 1700. I setup a 2nd SVP profile to use AI model 4.22 lite when the resolution height is > 1700. Using that AI model should be easier to drive, however it didn't help much. My system doesn't have issues playing back 4k videos with a height of less than 1700, even though RTSS always reports the 100% GPU usage. GPU usage is much less for 1080p videos.
1) Was this statement in regards to 24 to 48 fps conversions (frame doubling?)
2) Does this mean that 3840x1700 (black bars removed) is convertable from 24 to 48 fps with a 4080 super without issue using rife 4.16? (I'm guessing the <1700 pixel high 4k content you were playing was stuff with 2.39:1 aspect ratio as that comes out to about 3840x1607 with black bars.)
So based on the pixels you are processing (I won't bother to include padding to 32/64 pixel block sizes) 6528000 pixels.
For FHD 3D I'de need to process 3840x1080 which is 4147200 pixels.
I'm unsure how the load requirements change when you go from 24 to 48 vs 24 to 60 (aka 2x vs 2.5x).
It's unclear if the increased processing would be 1.5x or 2x what is required for regular doubling.
If it were 1.5x it's conceivable that a 4080 super might be able to process 3840x1080 from 24 to 60 fps.
If it's 2x though it's not going to be powerful enough....
Is there anyway you run a test to see what the max stable output for 24 to 60 hz at a frame width of 3840.
Wow so complicated lol. A 4080 can play 3D FTAB at 60Hz no problem. But with FSBS you have to downscale and turn off 3D processing in SVP. The End
Chainik wrote:dunno... turn off 10-bit mode?
i did wonder about that when I saw the original post. But for mpv it doesn't make much of a difference and I would be surprised if it did for mpc. But I can't see anything else either so it's worth a try
Drakko01 wrote:dawkinscm wrote:Drakko01 wrote:Hi, for those interesting , I'm give a run to the new pre-release vapoursynth R72-RC1 and a like the results , for all those that tell me there no benefit, blabla. All the times that I been saying that its good to update this, and Svp developers sooner or later give us the update, when its a latest version.
I've been thinking about upgrading Vapoursynth for a while now. What are the benefits you are seeing?
I always speak on what i see, never in technical aspect that not know. and maybe before I broke something for manual changes i made.
but after replace the files the playback was different and I prefer so.
What do you see?
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